Comments on: Lean is a Rumor, in China? http://www.leanblog.org/2008/08/lean-is-rumor-in-china/ Mark Graban's leanblog.org - Lean Healthcare, Lean Thinking, Lean Manufacturing, Toyota Production System Thu, 09 Feb 2012 15:26:57 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Chad http://www.leanblog.org/2008/08/lean-is-rumor-in-china/#comment-28631 Chad Fri, 27 Jan 2012 21:42:16 +0000 http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/08/lean-is-a-rumor-in-china/#comment-28631 I'm gonna semi-sorta hijack this comment thread for a similar line of thinking in a different industry. I'll also share these thoughts on the most recent Lean Blog entry about China. There is a parallel between the sports industry and operations in China. The mindset of cheap labor and "lean = cost cutting" exists in sports as well. I've worked seven straight days in a homestand for a minor league team, from 8 a.m. to 11 p.m. each day. If proper labor and safety practices are not adhered to, operators won't jump up to create a fuss because a) "sports" is a sexy industry and you're lucky to be in it at all, and b) if you create a fuss you'll be labeled a pariah and will have an even BIGGER hill to climb to get back into the industry. For the front line workers in concession stands, obedience is key if you want to last. (The worker strife in sports is nothing compared to what occurs in China, and it is certainly a societal and economic problem that will require many generations to fully overcome. I merely wanted to point out the parallel.) I’m gonna semi-sorta hijack this comment thread for a similar line of thinking in a different industry. I’ll also share these thoughts on the most recent Lean Blog entry about China.

There is a parallel between the sports industry and operations in China. The mindset of cheap labor and “lean = cost cutting” exists in sports as well. I’ve worked seven straight days in a homestand for a minor league team, from 8 a.m. to 11 p.m. each day. If proper labor and safety practices are not adhered to, operators won’t jump up to create a fuss because a) “sports” is a sexy industry and you’re lucky to be in it at all, and b) if you create a fuss you’ll be labeled a pariah and will have an even BIGGER hill to climb to get back into the industry. For the front line workers in concession stands, obedience is key if you want to last.

(The worker strife in sports is nothing compared to what occurs in China, and it is certainly a societal and economic problem that will require many generations to fully overcome. I merely wanted to point out the parallel.)

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]]> By: Jon Miller http://www.leanblog.org/2008/08/lean-is-rumor-in-china/#comment-3885 Jon Miller Thu, 14 Aug 2008 18:49:00 +0000 http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/08/lean-is-a-rumor-in-china/#comment-3885 Lean is not a rumor in China.<br/><br/>Quality, lead time, inventory, operating expenses and even productivity are areas of interest and concern by the Chinese government and private firms.<br/><br/>Chinese people have epic and boisterous disagreements and discussions. However, open challenge to authority in a way that makes authority lose face is rare. That is not necessarily incompatible with lean culture.<br/><br/>The interesting thing about rumors is that you can hear them with your ears but you not see them with your eyes. Lean is not a rumor in China.

Quality, lead time, inventory, operating expenses and even productivity are areas of interest and concern by the Chinese government and private firms.

Chinese people have epic and boisterous disagreements and discussions. However, open challenge to authority in a way that makes authority lose face is rare. That is not necessarily incompatible with lean culture.

The interesting thing about rumors is that you can hear them with your ears but you not see them with your eyes.

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]]> By: Industrial Guru http://www.leanblog.org/2008/08/lean-is-rumor-in-china/#comment-3884 Industrial Guru Thu, 14 Aug 2008 18:33:00 +0000 http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/08/lean-is-a-rumor-in-china/#comment-3884 Interesting article. The obedience and culture within the workplace are huge hurdles for lean and not something that can be changed with the simple declaration of a new policy by management. Interesting article. The obedience and culture within the workplace are huge hurdles for lean and not something that can be changed with the simple declaration of a new policy by management.

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]]> By: Anonymous http://www.leanblog.org/2008/08/lean-is-rumor-in-china/#comment-3883 Anonymous Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:57:00 +0000 http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/08/lean-is-a-rumor-in-china/#comment-3883 This is another example of the need to consider culture when talking about Lean. Being ideological about Lean can often lead to frustration, and fails to consider other important business and political conditions. To expect Lean to be effectively transferrabble to all businesses in all corners of the earth is foolhardy. I'd be interested in hearing some opinions of the business conditions, political conditions, and industrial maturity required to enable Lean to be the preferred operations strategy. This is another example of the need to consider culture when talking about Lean. Being ideological about Lean can often lead to frustration, and fails to consider other important business and political conditions. To expect Lean to be effectively transferrabble to all businesses in all corners of the earth is foolhardy. I’d be interested in hearing some opinions of the business conditions, political conditions, and industrial maturity required to enable Lean to be the preferred operations strategy.

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]]> By: Jens http://www.leanblog.org/2008/08/lean-is-rumor-in-china/#comment-3882 Jens Thu, 14 Aug 2008 11:18:00 +0000 http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/08/lean-is-a-rumor-in-china/#comment-3882 I've never been to China, but I will soon go there, to teach Lean actually. We have affiliates in China doing Lean production successfully and I will go there to teach them about Lean in business processes.<br/><br/>But I've been to India where I observed a similar phenomena as you describe. One example (of many) was when we arrived at the office building there were 4 elevators leading up to the offices. In each elevator a young Indian guy was standing all day long pushing the buttons for you. Completely unthinkable were I come from and not very Lean, but it's clearly the company taking a social responsibility. The alternative would be to send them back to misery.<br/><br/>Where you and I come from the social security nets look different, either it is financed through governmental taxes or through donations from people with excesses.<br/><br/>I think that is what the Chinese government is doing, encouraging companies to take a social responsibility and spreading the wealth to uneducated masses in order to lift the lower layers of society so they too can be an active part of the potentially huge market.<br/><br/>And since both India and China are outgrowing western countries, someone is doing something right.<br/><br/>I think we can combine a Lean mindset with social responsibility. Actually I think it's necessary. I’ve never been to China, but I will soon go there, to teach Lean actually. We have affiliates in China doing Lean production successfully and I will go there to teach them about Lean in business processes.

But I’ve been to India where I observed a similar phenomena as you describe. One example (of many) was when we arrived at the office building there were 4 elevators leading up to the offices. In each elevator a young Indian guy was standing all day long pushing the buttons for you. Completely unthinkable were I come from and not very Lean, but it’s clearly the company taking a social responsibility. The alternative would be to send them back to misery.

Where you and I come from the social security nets look different, either it is financed through governmental taxes or through donations from people with excesses.

I think that is what the Chinese government is doing, encouraging companies to take a social responsibility and spreading the wealth to uneducated masses in order to lift the lower layers of society so they too can be an active part of the potentially huge market.

And since both India and China are outgrowing western countries, someone is doing something right.

I think we can combine a Lean mindset with social responsibility. Actually I think it’s necessary.

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