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	<title>Comments on: Surgical Checklists in the News!</title>
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	<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/</link>
	<description>Mark Graban&#039;s leanblog.org - Lean Healthcare, Lean Thinking, Lean Manufacturing, Toyota Production System</description>
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		<title>By: Checklists and How You Manage Them — Lean Blog</title>
		<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/#comment-22680</link>
		<dc:creator>Checklists and How You Manage Them — Lean Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Jul 2011 23:24:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-the-news/#comment-22680</guid>
		<description>[...] Mark Graban on July 10, 2008 &#183; 4 comments   Thinking back to a letter-to-the-editor that I mentioned last week, this is such a critical point, I wanted to think and write about it again, especially since it was [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Mark Graban on July 10, 2008 &middot; 4 comments   Thinking back to a letter-to-the-editor that I mentioned last week, this is such a critical point, I wanted to think and write about it again, especially since it was [...]</p>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-22680" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('22680', 'add', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-22680-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-22680" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('22680', 'subtract', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-22680-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Checklists and How You Manage Them — Lean Blog</title>
		<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/#comment-20041</link>
		<dc:creator>Checklists and How You Manage Them — Lean Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Apr 2011 11:58:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-the-news/#comment-20041</guid>
		<description>[...] Mark Graban on July 10, 2008 &#183; 4 comments        Thinking back to a letter-to-the-editor that I mentioned last week, this is such a critical point, I wanted to think and write about it again, especially since it was [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Mark Graban on July 10, 2008 &middot; 4 comments        Thinking back to a letter-to-the-editor that I mentioned last week, this is such a critical point, I wanted to think and write about it again, especially since it was [...]</p>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-20041" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('20041', 'add', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-20041-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-20041" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('20041', 'subtract', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-20041-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mark Graban</title>
		<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/#comment-4503</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Graban</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Feb 2009 21:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-the-news/#comment-4503</guid>
		<description>To the surgeon -- thanks for your comments. I realize now you were referring to Andy&#039;s story above in the comments.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;There is a difference between &quot;one hour before&quot; and &quot;within an hour of surgery.&quot; &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Having a checklist right before the surgery is like an inspection. If they hadn&#039;t given the antibiotic 60 minutes before surgery, it&#039;s too late when the checklist is being used. The checklist should guide the process to PREVENT mistakes/omissions rather than catching them at the last minute. So I think we&#039;re saying the same thing, that a checklist at the very last minute might not be the right timing?&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I do share your concerns about the checklist being driven &quot;top down.&quot; That&#039;s not normally the best way to implement lasting change.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I hope we can have some more interaction about this and other topics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To the surgeon &#8212; thanks for your comments. I realize now you were referring to Andy&#8217;s story above in the comments.</p>
<p>There is a difference between &#8220;one hour before&#8221; and &#8220;within an hour of surgery.&#8221; </p>
<p>Having a checklist right before the surgery is like an inspection. If they hadn&#8217;t given the antibiotic 60 minutes before surgery, it&#8217;s too late when the checklist is being used. The checklist should guide the process to PREVENT mistakes/omissions rather than catching them at the last minute. So I think we&#8217;re saying the same thing, that a checklist at the very last minute might not be the right timing?</p>
<p>I do share your concerns about the checklist being driven &#8220;top down.&#8221; That&#8217;s not normally the best way to implement lasting change.</p>
<p>I hope we can have some more interaction about this and other topics.</p>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-4503" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('4503', 'add', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-4503-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-4503" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('4503', 'subtract', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-4503-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: trenga</title>
		<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/#comment-4501</link>
		<dc:creator>trenga</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Feb 2009 19:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-the-news/#comment-4501</guid>
		<description>I am not saying or trying to imply either of the two items you write. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;This is what I am saying:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;1.) The initial comment indicates that the author&#039;s wife did not receive the standard of care. With regards to timely administration of an antibiotic, she did. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;2.) A checklist was not used to make this happen. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;If one is trying to make the case for the use of checklists, this anecdote gives little support. This patient received appropriate care without the use of a checklist. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Let us imagine that the WHO Surgical Safety Checklist (First Edition) had been used in this patient&#039;s care. The check item &quot;has antibiotic prophylaxis been given within the last 60 minutes?&quot; is number 13 of 22 on this particular checklist. This check would be done moments prior to the skin incision. This check would not have averted a similar conversation between the nurse and the anesthesiologist. Nor would it have caused an improved timing for administration of the antibiotic.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I have not made up my mind about the use of surgical checklists. There are pros and cons. Current medical literature does not support or disprove that the use of a checklist can improve patient safety in a United States hospital.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I appreciate your initial blogging about the implementation of checklists. I am the surgery section chief (practicing general surgeon) at a hospital that is planning to implement a surgical safety checklist. The initial stages of the planning indicate this is going to come from a &quot;top down&quot; approach under nursing direction. I would like to see a more grassroots approach to this implementation and your comments support this view.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am not saying or trying to imply either of the two items you write. </p>
<p>This is what I am saying:</p>
<p>1.) The initial comment indicates that the author&#8217;s wife did not receive the standard of care. With regards to timely administration of an antibiotic, she did. </p>
<p>2.) A checklist was not used to make this happen. </p>
<p>If one is trying to make the case for the use of checklists, this anecdote gives little support. This patient received appropriate care without the use of a checklist. </p>
<p>Let us imagine that the WHO Surgical Safety Checklist (First Edition) had been used in this patient&#8217;s care. The check item &#8220;has antibiotic prophylaxis been given within the last 60 minutes?&#8221; is number 13 of 22 on this particular checklist. This check would be done moments prior to the skin incision. This check would not have averted a similar conversation between the nurse and the anesthesiologist. Nor would it have caused an improved timing for administration of the antibiotic.</p>
<p>I have not made up my mind about the use of surgical checklists. There are pros and cons. Current medical literature does not support or disprove that the use of a checklist can improve patient safety in a United States hospital.  </p>
<p>I appreciate your initial blogging about the implementation of checklists. I am the surgery section chief (practicing general surgeon) at a hospital that is planning to implement a surgical safety checklist. The initial stages of the planning indicate this is going to come from a &#8220;top down&#8221; approach under nursing direction. I would like to see a more grassroots approach to this implementation and your comments support this view.</p>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-4501" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('4501', 'add', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-4501-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-4501" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('4501', 'subtract', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-4501-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mark Graban</title>
		<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/#comment-4500</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Graban</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Feb 2009 16:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-the-news/#comment-4500</guid>
		<description>So @nickname_unavailable&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I&#039;m not sure what you&#039;re trying to say.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;1) Checklists aren&#039;t necessary&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;2) You&#039;re thankful the right things were done without a checklist being used</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So @nickname_unavailable</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure what you&#8217;re trying to say.</p>
<p>1) Checklists aren&#8217;t necessary</p>
<p>2) You&#8217;re thankful the right things were done without a checklist being used</p>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-4500" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('4500', 'add', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-4500-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-4500" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('4500', 'subtract', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-4500-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Nickname unavailable</title>
		<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/#comment-4499</link>
		<dc:creator>Nickname unavailable</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Feb 2009 16:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-the-news/#comment-4499</guid>
		<description>Your wife received the antibiotic within one hour of surgery. This meets the SCIP guideline at the link listed below. No luck or checklist was involved.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your wife received the antibiotic within one hour of surgery. This meets the SCIP guideline at the link listed below. No luck or checklist was involved.</p>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-4499" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('4499', 'add', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-4499-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-4499" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('4499', 'subtract', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-4499-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mark Graban</title>
		<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/#comment-3719</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Graban</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 17:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-the-news/#comment-3719</guid>
		<description>Nice comment in a Letter to the Editor about the UK aricle:&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&quot;While a front-page feature on &quot;A Surgical Revolution&quot; (&quot;A checklist that could prevent thousands of deaths&quot;, 25 June) is to be welcomed, our research over the past five years into teamwork in surgery shows that the checklist in itself is not really the point. What is important is the quality of its implementation.&quot;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;That&#039;s spot on, for any type of standardized work. Having a document is worthless if people don&#039;t follow it... leaders have to manage the process and follow up properly to make sure the checklist or standardized work is being used, that it&#039;s helping, and that it&#039;s being improved upon.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;a HREF=&quot;http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/letters/letters-interfering-state-858284.html&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;LINK (scroll down)&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice comment in a Letter to the Editor about the UK aricle:</p>
<p>&#8220;While a front-page feature on &#8220;A Surgical Revolution&#8221; (&#8220;A checklist that could prevent thousands of deaths&#8221;, 25 June) is to be welcomed, our research over the past five years into teamwork in surgery shows that the checklist in itself is not really the point. What is important is the quality of its implementation.&#8221;</p>
<p>That&#8217;s spot on, for any type of standardized work. Having a document is worthless if people don&#8217;t follow it&#8230; leaders have to manage the process and follow up properly to make sure the checklist or standardized work is being used, that it&#8217;s helping, and that it&#8217;s being improved upon.</p>
<p><a HREF="http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/letters/letters-interfering-state-858284.html" REL="nofollow">LINK (scroll down)</a></p>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-3719" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('3719', 'add', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-3719-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-3719" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('3719', 'subtract', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-3719-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Andy Wagner</title>
		<link>http://www.leanblog.org/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-news/#comment-3705</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Wagner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 00:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://leanblog.bigbigdesign.net/2008/06/surgical-checklists-in-the-news/#comment-3705</guid>
		<description>Tonight we celebrate one month since my daughter was born.  It was a c-section and I wish I had a recording of the conversation between the anesthesiologist and the nurse.  It sounded like a Laurel and Hardy sketch as they discussed who gave my wife the pre-surgery anti-biotic.  &quot;I thought you did it.&quot;  &quot;I didn&#039;t do it.&quot;&lt;br/&gt;Later we found the poster proclaiming the hospital&#039;s goal for &quot;Surgical Excellence&quot; that all patients receive anti-biotic 1 hour prior to surgery.  My wife got hers about 2 minutes before surgery.&lt;br/&gt;Hence, the 91% rating.&lt;br/&gt;Where&#039;s the checklist when you need it?&lt;br/&gt;Luckily, wife and daughter came through it happy and healthy.&lt;br/&gt;-Andy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tonight we celebrate one month since my daughter was born.  It was a c-section and I wish I had a recording of the conversation between the anesthesiologist and the nurse.  It sounded like a Laurel and Hardy sketch as they discussed who gave my wife the pre-surgery anti-biotic.  &#8220;I thought you did it.&#8221;  &#8220;I didn&#8217;t do it.&#8221;<br />Later we found the poster proclaiming the hospital&#8217;s goal for &#8220;Surgical Excellence&#8221; that all patients receive anti-biotic 1 hour prior to surgery.  My wife got hers about 2 minutes before surgery.<br />Hence, the 91% rating.<br />Where&#8217;s the checklist when you need it?<br />Luckily, wife and daughter came through it happy and healthy.<br />-Andy</p>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="up-3705" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('3705', 'add', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-3705-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" onmouseover="this.width=this.width*1.3" onmouseout="this.width=this.width/1.2" id="down-3705" src="http://www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('3705', 'subtract', 'www.leanblog.org/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-3705-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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